Sub-titled: Why this draft was conservative and you should still like it.

The Cardinals have long been criticized because of what draft watchers consider and over-fondness for college players resulting in low upside drafts.  These critics point at a system largely devoid of high ceiling talent as evidence of the conservative drafts.

The flipside of this is that college players are categorically more likely to return value in the major leagues to a club in the first two rounds.  It’s really not even close when considering the averages. The psychological aspect of human mind rarely rewards probabilistic thinking and is far more inclined to think in absolutes or hyperbolic statements.

So while the Cardinals approach the draft in a way that is most likely to offer the highest return on their investments, they leave themselves open to criticism that argues that they’re not picking the safe college picks instead of the high reward-high risk high school players.  It’s a catch-22.

I’m often inclined to side with the critics.  I’d contend that the Cardinals take their risks in the wrong places.  When they want what they consider a higher upside player in the early rounds, it seems like they too often dip their toes in the pool of raw college players.  I’d point to players like Chris Lambert and Mark McCormick or, to a lesser extent, Adam Ottavino as players who lacked polish but represented more significant upside.  With lesser signing demands and leverage, they represent safe but potentially rewarding picks.

Now to get to the heart of the argument at hand: the 2010 draft.  I’m here to tell you the Cardinals didn’t deviate from a conservative draft but still managed to have a good overall draft.  What follows is my analysis and opinion of the Cardinals draft.  It’s not the snap judgments that I made on draft day, though I suspect it’s not that far apart.

In the first 10 rounds representing 12 picks, the Cardinals selected just 2 high school players.  Tyrell Jenkins is a raw arm with above average velocity and sketchy secondary pitches. He’s projectable but he’s raw.  For their high school position player, they took Sam Tuivailala.  Tuivailala represents a raw athlete who was looked at for both his pitching ability and his skills at shortstop.  Tui may be headed for third base if he sticks as a position player but the bat speed and strength should play.

Beyond the first 10 rounds, of course, the Cardinals snared the exclusive negotiating rights with Austin Wilson.  It’s difficult to get too excited about this pick given the difficulty that they likely face in signing him and the acknowledgment of that by taking him in the 12th round.  Wilson represents the epitome of a high upside high school player showcasing a man-child’s body with speed, power and arm strength. Wilson was one of 9 high school picks after the first 10 rounds.

In 52 picks, the Cardinals selected 11 players out of high school.  21% is a deceptive number because there are more players selected from college every year than from high school.  (I’m sure someone reading this can dig up the average % of high school picks by teams. I had a link at one point but I’ve misplaced it.) I’m relatively certain this number is low though not outrageously so.  A cursory glance at the NL Central Lists shows the Cardinals tied for last in high school selections. (Chi – 13, Cin – 13, Hou – 23, Mil – 11, Pitt – 26)

So where the Cardinals went with raw talent early, they went with high school players.  When they wanted a lottery ticket, albeit an expensive one, they went with a high school player in round 12 who would have been a first round talent if not for signability questions.  The Cardinals didn’t pick a lot of high school talent but you have to like the high level ones they did select.  This isn’t a draft with a lot of risks on athletes who are new to baseball but it’s a draft that feels like the right risks.

Rightly or wrongly, the first pick in any draft will have to shoulder an uneven amount of responsibility for any retrospective evaluation of that class. The Cardinals picked up a player that no one thought would fall to them in Zach Cox. He was, according to most, the best player available when the Cardinals came up to the podium. He’s also a rather safe pick.  A polished hitter with a quick bat, there’s very little doubt that Cox will hit. (Personally, I like his swing more than Brett Wallace by a healthy margin.) There is some debate about what kind of power Cox will have. I’m somewhere in the middle on that as I see him as more of a 10-15 HR guy with lots of doubles but not insane amounts of power. He’ll likely be an average defender at 3rd or 2nd with repetition and has decent range with a strong arm.  I like his upside as a 4 WAR type player in the infield. Not crazy superstar high but solid.  Again, the downside is something like a replacement level player so there’s not to much risk here.

The Cardinals took a pair of college arms in the supplemental and 2nd round in Seth Blair and Jordan Swaggerty.  If you want to be critical of the Cardinals’ draft, start here. Both pitchers profile better as relievers though they’ll both begin as starters if the Cardinals sign them. While pitching prospects are an incredibly fickle projection, these are the kinds of players that have a nice fallback plan as a reliever. It’s also one of my least favorite type of picks.  They’re likely to give up velocity as a starter putting them at servicable low-90s guys with a good secondary pitch and questionable offerings beyond that.

The 4th and 5th round picks are both ones that I like a lot. The Cardinals selected a catcher in Cody Stanley who is more athletic than your average catcher and not some hulking behemoth behind the plate.  He’s your typical catcher though – average tools defensively and offensively with gap power  – and not likely to be a star.  Nick Longmire features great tools that have been up and down performance-wise in college.  The quick start has brought him to the forefront of the 2010 draftees and I like him a lot.  He’s got considerable room to fill out and more refined workout program should help him achieve some impressive results If you want the surprise high-upside pick from the first 5 rounds, it’s this guy.

After the first 5 rounds, the Cardinals seemed to tighten up selecting 3 boring lefthanded college pitchers in their next 5 picks. John Gast, Daniel Bibona and Tyler Lyons are all fine pitchers but none of them profile as more than average starting pitchers.  They’ll throw a fastball that resides in the 88-90mph. Gast has a touch more on his fastball but considerably worse command. Smashed in there were two questionable position player picks with Greg Garcia who — tell me if you’ve heard this before — has a nice glove at short but a questionable bat.   Reggie Williams Jr. was an OF with some speed who doesn’t have good baseball instincts and lacks standout tools elsewhere.

To wrap things up, this isn’t a crazy upside draft by any means. I’d contend that it’s a rather conservative one. Looking at the first 10 rounds (12 picks), I’ve got four players with high upside: Cox, Longmire, Tuivailala, Jenkins. The first two are relatively low risk “knowns”.  The latter are about as raw as you can get for players but they’re young and should be easier to shape. Statistically, Tuivailala may be the best type of player to pick in the third round (Wang’s study differs from Jazayerli’s in this regard so it’s still debatable).  The Cardinals also selected three players with what I’d label moderate upside: Blair, Swaggerty, Stanley. They’re all relatively low risk. Blair and Swaggerty should contribute out of the pen at a minimum with a chance to be decent starters. Stanley is a good catcher but not a great overall player. . The collection of players that I’m simply not that high on (low upside) would be: Garcia, Gast, Bibona, Lyons, Williams. Garcia is the only one that I think will move the minors at a decent clip. He’s a good fielding shortstop and should get a look at the upper minors relatively quickly. The three lefties are questionable picks for me. Gast’s command and durability issues and the questions regarding the stuff of Bibona and Lyons makes these players risky for returns on investment. Williams is . . . well, I just don’t like that pick at all.

The Cardinals had a solid draft but it’s not going to produce a lot of “blue chip” type prospects. It portends well for depth throughout the system and some players who can be good major leaguers. If the Cardinals sign Wilson, this draft moves from solid to good. It’s a typical draft for the Cardinals and one that’s served them well in recent years — time will be the ultimate judge of the 2010 draft.

39 Responses to “2010 Draft Commentary”
  1. jws003 says:

    Good read, thanks for posting that.

    The only fault, IMO of course, that I can find with that is your projection of Cox’s power. I’m obvious not a scout and thus my opinion should be taken with a grain of salt, but I’ve seen nearly every single one of Cox’s games at Arkansas. If he doesn’t hit 20+ HR’s a year for the Cardinals, I’ll eat my hat. I’m not saying he’s a huge power guy who could hit 30-something bombs, but I will be shocked if he doesn’t hit 20-25 consistently..

    One question I do have, is why was Tyrell Jenkins seen as such a high upside pick? Don’t get me wrong, I’m obviously excited about the kid, but he doesn’t have amazing velocity and from what I read, and what you said, he doesn’t have any great secondary pitches. Does he profile as an innings-eater, a K-machine, etc.? What are we dealing with here?

  2. JC says:

    I would have to disagree with one statement that you posted…I see Seth Blair as a starter long term not a reliever. He is well built for the workload of a starter, has a nice sinking FB (plus FB IMO) in the low 90′s range (can pump it up to mid-90′s), has 2 breaking balls (CB and SL) SL has potential to be a plus pitch and CB is below avg but has potential to be avg and he has a CH that has potential to be slightly above avg. That is 4 pitches that is avg or above and even if 3 of them pan out that is plenty for a starter. I see him as a #3/4 type starter. Give me your thoughts on why you think he is destine for the pen. Thanks.

  3. JC says:

    @jws003: Jenkins is projectable and super athletic (maybe the best athlete of all HS pitchers). His FB sits in the low to mid 90′s already so one would think he has potential to sit in the mid-90′s consistently as he grows. All his secondary pitches are raw and a work in progress. Part of the issue is he was a big time football star in HS as well so he couldn’t focus as much time on pitching. His secondary pitches consist of CB, SL and CH (I’ve read in more than one spot his CB has potential to be a plus pitch). His CH and SL both project as avg pitches. He needs work on repeating his delivery as well which should help with his control as well. All in all we got a guy that should have a 4 pitch arsenal all avg or above. Obviously he is a project and will need to spend multiple years in the low minors so we will have to be patient with him.

  4. Andrew says:

    Jenkins is upside because hes a terrific athlete. He was a 3 sports star in college, can get it up to 94-95 I think and actually has a better curve and change than people think. His upside comes from the fact that he hasn’t even focused on baseball full time yet, he has a big arm and a clean and easy delievery. He reminds me alot of Doc Gooden.

  5. CRay says:

    I don’t disagree with you concerning Bibona, az, but I would love to know what the Cards see in him. They picked him in round 16 in the ’09 draft but couldn’t sign him, and then they pick him again this year. Someone must have thought highly of this guy. I wonder what they see that you don’t? Perhaps just a leftie starter to take a chance on?

  6. BaylorDan says:

    Our top four picks are unsigned as well as Austin Wilson. Do you have any idea how the negotiations are going with those five? And what does 4 WAR mean?

  7. azruavatar says:

    @BaylorDan: No idea on the negotiations but it’s way to early to be worried about that. Cox and Jenkins are likely slot or higher. Blair is perplexing but he may be taking a hard line.

    WAR stands for wins above replacement. 2 WAR is an average player. 4 WAR is a very good player. 6 WAR is a star. 8 WAR is Albert Pujols. Here’s a primer on Fangraphs WAR which is the most commonly cited variety: http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.php/glossary/#winvalues

  8. azruavatar says:

    @jws003: My opinion on Cox is very much up for review — I expect it to change over the course of the next 6 months. Jenkins sits low 90s now and, as others have noted, is very athletic. It’s all about projection with Jenkins.

    @JC: Keith law was relatively positive on Blair in his comments. I think there’s a little too much confidence in some of Blair’s secondary offerings. I also worry about how his velocity is going to hold up as a starter. The Cardinals are going to try him as a starter and I think he could work there . . . but I think he’s more likely a reliever.

  9. JC says:

    @azruavatar: Thanks for the clarification…but I will stick with my guns and say he is a starter. From multiple sources much smarter than I am in the scouting community and me seeing him pitch about 4-5 times throughout the year I definitely see a starter. But we are all certainly entitled to our opinions.

  10. cariocacardinal says:

    I guess my expectations are lower for Gast, Bilbona, and Lyons. You sound as if you’re disappointed that none would be more than average starter. I’d be thrilled with that. My true hope is one of the 3 makes it as a LOOGY. Anything more than that is pure bonus.

  11. azruavatar says:

    @cariocacardinal: I’m disappointed that their ceiling is, imo, back end starter. I just see a lot of flaws with those guys that seem so readily apparent. I may be too harsh on later round choices but I’m just not impressed with any of them.

  12. Anderw says:

    There weren’t many lefties with much upside that low in the draft. Seems like in the cases of the lefties they weren’t drafting BPA but instead was trying to fill an organizational need.

  13. rydeshelby says:

    Williams is a switch-hitter and speedy, like Willie McGee. If not a development project, Williams would not have been available in the 10th round.
    Bibona did well at Irvine, like Gorgen. Lyons and Bibona are cost-saving senior southpaws, saving budget for Austin Wilson. Luhnow likes to sign draftees, not waste picks; he will make a serious offer to Wilson.

  14. rydeshelby says:

    @azruavatar: Based on his 2010, how do you feel about LHP Ryan Kulik? Was Kulik a good pick for the 8th round?

  15. Indiana Cardinal says:

    Generally I like the way that the Cards have been drafting. They seem to be willing to take a high upside player when it fits with their draft position, e.g. Rasmus and Miller, and a guy like Wilson. Wilson, if they can blow him and his parents away and sign him, is Exhibit A of what teams like the Red Sox do, that is drafting solid picks early in the draft, but then picking players that are viewed as unsignable later in the draft.

    The Cards seem to be drafting and developing an extremely deep minor league system, that gives them numerous players to use as needed during the season to fill in (Stavinhoa, Craig, Anderson, Ottavino, Maclaine, etc.) or trade (Todd, Perez, Mortenson, Wallace, Peterson), with a few players from that become (Rasmus, Garcia, Freese) solid starters or better, or could become solid starters (Jay, Greene, Motte).

    Hopefully they can use some of their depth to trade for what they currently need (1-2 starters and/or middle infield help).

  16. giveml says:

    I Ihink it is important to remember that Victor’s analysis only covers the first six years of a player’s MLB career. I think this approach totally ignores the fact that the best chance a team like the Cardinals has to obtain a star player is to draft him and give him a multi-year deal that buys out a couple of his FA years. I would hate to do an analysis that ignores the value of Adam Wainwright in 2012 and 2013 when he will likely generate tons of surplus value. If Wainwright pitched for another team and was on the FA market after the 2011 season the Cardinals chances of signing him would be, as the futbol guys like to say, nil.

  17. zuke354 says:

    I think the draft approach should mirror the minor’s prospect depth. A quantity vs. quality analaysis.

    The cards are pretty deplated and need to add some players (quantity). You do that through a conservative approach and retool the minors. Once you build up your stock, then go for more lottery tickets (quality). While Allen Craig and nick Stavinoa are not sexy, they are very productive and necessary pieces.

    Looking back at the 2006 draft, an extremly conservative draft, there have been 6 players who have already contributed. a 50% rate.

    If you only focus on getting the high up side, diamond in the rough, you end up with nothing. Maybe get one or 2 blue chippers, but have nothing else in the organization.

  18. Vision says:

    @JC:

    I just want to post something that is a bit of a misnomer with Jenkins. Phil Steele has him as the (off memory) #343 QB in the country. That number might not be 100% exact, as I’m away from my magazine, but it’s definitely in the 340′s for QB’s. Not players overall, but QB’s. The notion that Jenkins was a big time football athlete is not correct. He was more of a track star, than a QB. There is also the misnomer that he was their (Baylor) only QB recruit, when he wasn’t. They had the #40-ish QB commit to them and greyshirt, meaning he didn’t enroll until January so his scholarship would count towards the next year.

    Baylor, or more specifically, their coach Art Briles, has had some success in taking track athletes and making them QB’s in his system. Their starting QB is a near Olympic level hurdler.

    So, in short, Jenkins wasn’t a big time football recruit in all reality. He’s a big time baseball player and track athlete.

    Not calling out the OP, just pointing out something I’ve seen several times in regards to Jenkins.

  19. azruavatar says:

    @rydeshelby: What an obviously baited trap. “Based on his 2010″ is a poor way to evaluate players. Even so, Kulik’s numbers are mostly a mirage as he can’t strike anyone out and is only an average-ish groundball pitcher. I’ve seen Kulik live on a couple occassions and wasn’t impressed.

    As far as whether he was a good pick . . . he’s fine. The club needs organizational players and there’s a chance that those guys will turn into something more. That chance is slim though and I’m not a Kulik enthusiast.

  20. BaylorDan says:

    Vision, I am a Baylor fan and know that the football program values his scholarship although the baseball program no doubt pegs him as an even better prospect. He was not a “track star” at Henderson High. He did run an anchor lap on the 1600 relay with a good time in a particular meet but I believe he was only part time in that sport. He also played basketball and, of course, is very athletic. Whatever his decision is regarding signing with the Cardinals, as a Baylor fan it is a win, win deal for me.

  21. Vision says:

    @BaylorDan:

    Ok, he was a baseball star. Sounds good to me…

  22. JC says:

    @Vision: Guess I used football star a little loosely. But you don’t get a scholarship from Baylor unless your pretty darn good. My point is he is an extremely good athlete that played multiple sports. Now he will focus on one sport (assuming he signs).

  23. Vision says:

    @JC:

    I get where you’re coming from, but people said the same thing about Anthony Bryant and USC, and he wasn’t really a big recruit either.

    My real point is that we’re not trying to sign Zach Wheeler here. Who is a big time football prospect, and does have a chance at actually playing one day. We’re signing a marginal prospect, who was probably a fallback option, or an under the radar type kid.

    Basically, I 100% expect him to sign to play baseball, and was surprised that so many outlets talked about him as though he was an uber stud football player.

  24. JC says:

    @Vision: To me this just means he has more leverage. Players/Agents will use any angle to get a little more money. He is legit though…not a marginal prospect by any means. He was projected to go as high as the late 1st Rd and no later than 2nd Rd. He has a legit FB and projection to go along with secondary stuff that has potential to be solid. As far as Anthony Bryant you have to be pretty special to get a scholarship to USC to play football (much more so than Baylor). So Bryant was a legit football player and athlete. Not really sure where you are coming from with your comments. It all goes back to players having more leverage when they have dual scholarships or other opportunities. Its that simple.

  25. jws003 says:

    @JC:

    Anthony Bryant definitely DID NOT have an offer to play football at USC, he might have had one for baseball, but he’s not anywhere near the caliber of football player to get an offer from USC. He couldn’t use that as leverage, which probably explains why he is already signed, but I think that mostly has to do with him being a lower-round pick and not warranting a high signing bonus, unlike Jenkins.

    Tyrell’s offer and commitment to Baylor to play QB is legit (I follow football recruiting incessantly, so I actually knew about Jenkins as the Baylor commit before he was taken by the Cardinals), whereas Bryant was simply a “USC recruit” and had received a few pieces of mail, etc. but wasn’t actually ever given a scholarship.

    I get what you’re saying regarding leverage, but IMO, Bryant and Jenkins aren’t even in comparable situations. Now Jenkins and someone like Delino Deshields Jr., who was also a high pick and has a legit scholarship to play RB at a D-1 program (LSU), are very much similar in their athletic circumstances and the amount of leverage those circumstances provide them and their agent in contract negotiations..

  26. JC says:

    @jws003: I apologize as I thought for sure he had a scholarship to play football at USC. If not a scholarship he was going to USC to play both baseball and football. Maybe not the same situation as Jenkins but that is leverage regardless.

  27. jws003 says:

    @JC:

    Yea, we’re on the same page.. I was just making the point that Jenkins has a bit more leverage because he has a full scholarship to play QB at Baylor and is a more talented baseball player (similar to Deshields), whereas Bryant is only a USC recruit who was going to walk on to play football and probably only receive a partial scholarship to play baseball. Either way though, both guys can use that leverage to their advantage..

    By the way, thanks for your breakdown on Jenkins above, I’m really excited about this kid now if we can get him signed!

  28. JC says:

    @jws003: He excites me as well if you didn’t notice! But I hope everyone gets the caution of BE PATIENT! He is raw…will need probably 2.5-3 yrs in the lower minors and his stats will most likely be subpar for the first year and a half (except K’s as he should be able to blow away hitters in low minors with his FB). I just hate when fans expect miracles in a half year or even a full year and are ready to call a guy a bust. Every prospect is different and some are more advanced.

  29. Vision says:

    @JC:

    I meant marginal on Jenkins in the way of as a football recruit. For me, this is the stuff I love, so I won’t say: “Trust me I know about Jenkins,” I will say I’ve watched his video, read about him etc. and realize he is upside insane on the mound. Love the kid for baseball, just after doing more research, was very surprised to find he wasn’t a big football recruit at all. He was ranked much lower than several kids who went DII or low DI conferences.

  30. Vision says:

    @JC:

    The Anthony Bryant angle has been covered above I see, so i won’t go down that angle again. He wasn’t a football recruit to USC at all.

  31. Andrew says:

    Was the fact that he was only going to recieve a partial scholarship before or after USC lost many of there scholarships due to the Reggie Bush violation? I read an article how Bryant was unknown in his homestate of Texas as a football player because he didn’t play too much but USC found him and offered a schlorship because of his physical gifts. I don’t remember if he was a reciever or a reciever and a safety?

  32. Andrew says:

    A talented Texas recruit flying under many radars appears to be a major blip at USC. Pflugerville Connally multi-sport standout Anthony Bryant has shown some skills at football and baseball and the 6-3, 215-pounder won the 25-5A 100-meters. That’s a WOW athlete _ a 3-sport 5A star has a little something _ who seems to be getting more attention from out of state than in Texas.

    Bryant is leaning toward an official announcement to commit to USC where he’ll likely play baseball and football. He only had 10 catches last season, but it was for more than 200 yards. He also had a standout summer in baseball? Definitely a name to remember this year and in the future?

    Guess this is inconclusive about if he was going to be getting a scholarship at USC or not, if so that may have changed when they lost so many scholarships.

  33. Andrew says:

    If there is a true sleeper candidate among this year’s Cardinals’ draft picks, it just might be high school outfielder Anthony Bryant of Austin, Texas, selected in the 16th round.

    Bryant did not go higher in the draft because he is still a raw baseball player, and because he also happens to be a raw football player, but one with enough athletic talent to be offered a scholarship as a wide receiver by USC. He also was a track star in high school, winning the district 100-meter championship.

    He also is 6-foot-3, 215 pounds, a lefthanded hitter and someone who area scout Ralph Garr Jr. thinks just might be a major-leaguer one day.

    “He kind of let it be known from day one that professional baseball was where he wanted to be,” Garr said. “He said baseball was his first love.”

    Garr, the son of former major league outfielder Ralph Garr, developed a good relationship with Bryant’s family before the draft, but told Bryant and his mother that what they were looking for as a signing bonus was not going to work for him and the Cardinals. As the early rounds of the draft progressed, and Bryant had not been selected, he began to lower his demands.

    “They texted me and called me during the draft and told me they really wanted to go out and play,” Garr said. “I let them know what we could do, and they agreed over the phone. It was refreshing — they were people of their word. Once I got to their home to sign him, there was no problem whatsoever.”

    In his second year as the area scout handling Texas high schools and junior colleges for the Cardinals, Garr has seen some outstanding players. He was responsible for scouting Shelby Miller last year, and supplemental first-round pick Tyrell Jenkins this year.

    Even though Bryant is not as high profile of a choice, Garr thinks the 499th overall pick in the draft could develop into a player who will have a chance.

    “He’s not refined but he’s got tools,” Garr said. “He’s got power, he’s a plus runner, he’s a very good athlete. He’s strong, but he’s still got young muscles. I think he’s kind of a throwback, like a lot of guys from the 1970s and ‘80s.

    “When some of those guys got a lot of at-bats and starting concentrating on baseball, they turned out pretty good. I’m hoping that’s the case with Anthony.”

    Bryant will most likely begin his professional career in the rookie Gulf Coast League.

  34. rydeshelby says:

    @Andrew: Ralph Garr Jr. is doing good work.

  35. Andrew says:

    Sure is.

  36. rydeshelby says:

    @azruavatar: You expressed disappointment in the three southpaws, Gast, Bibona, Lyons. Yet, as you appreciate with Kulik, the Cards need guys to staff their system. We are not drafting 50 future ML stars in every draft.
    While a fortunate few have great gifts, a lot of others are good players, but not great. They could reach the majors, if things break their way. Or peak at AA or AAA. We can use Gast, and if they wake up and sign, Bibona and Lyons too. Nothing wrong with picking the three lefties.

  37. Vision says:

    @Andrew:

    These guys are making the right choice with baseball…(Jenkins and Bryant). Both are great athletes, and have a future with baseball.

  38. Andrew says:

    Completely agree on them making the right choice.

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