Reliever David Carpenter traded for Infielder Pedro Feliz
Posted by azruavatar in David CarpenterHaving read some of the comments in the other thread, I think everyone is WAY off base here. I’m not a fan of Pedro Feliz but David Carpenter was not a top 5 relief prospect and probably not a top 30 prospect. We traded a non-prospect for a really bad player. It’s perhaps the least consequential move possible but no one should be disappointed about losing Carpenter. If you want to call this a bad trade, focus on the acquisition of Feliz not the departure of Carpenter.
For David, he’s likely in a better place now. He’s got legitimate relief arm but he’s more of a fringe setup type than a closer (and that’s a pretty rosy assessment). The Astros system is barren as opposed to the Cardinals relief system that has guys like Adam Reifer, Eduardo Sanchez, Casey Mulligan, Blake King, Francisco Samuel, etc. in front of him.
Good luck, David.
[Update: Hardcore Legend]
The Cardinals acquired Pedro Feliz’s glove and some cash in exchange for David Carpenter’s arm.
While Feliz has been one of the worst hitters in baseball for quite a while, his defense will most certainly be better than that of Felipe Lopez. The offense has been stagnant of late (other than El Hombre) but it shouldn’t go without notice that at least one game this week was lost because Felipe has trouble with the catching and throwing aspect of the game.
As for David, he was a bit old for the level he was pitching at but as the closer he racked up 20 saves while posting a 8.4 k/9 rate this season. Carpenter picked up that 20th save last night while striking out 2 in the 9th. Since the end of May, David had pitched 31 IP while only giving up 4 ER and striking out 26.
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That’s more of what my comments were about … acquisition of Feliz. Many more talented RPs in our system than Carpenter.
There’s probably some lingering soreness left over from the Gregerson trade (unheralded reliever traded for veteran) that’s causing some of the negative reaction, but my impression of Gregerson back that was that he was a rising prospect who was further along than Carpenter both in development and performance.
Gregerson already had a major league out pitch in his slider when he was traded. (it was already that good).
I am okay with trading that Carpenter. At first I thought they sent Matt Carpenter to the Stros.
I don’t object to losing this Carpenter (unlike, it needn’t be said, the other two…), and let’s face it, Floppy hasn’t been getting the job done, with no reason to expect that he’s going to. He’s a utility man and overextended in any starting role. But Pedro Friggin’ FELIZ?
I think too many people are confusing this Carp with the 3B Carp
We have to remember that Carpenter has only been pitching 2.5 years. Unlike Mulligan who pitched a lot in HS I believe Carpenter had never pitched at all when he transitioned. At this point I agree he was not a top prospect but the numbers for the last few months have been awesome. If you look at him from an age perspective he was not a prospect. If you look at him from an experience perspective he probably was. I remember a report from some scout somewhere (sorry, cant do better memory wise) that thought Carpenter had more potential than Mulligan.
From what I’ve read, however, that had as much to do with lack of enthusiasm for Mulligan as a thumbs-up for Carpenter. Scouts seem baffled as to how Casey gets ‘em out. Given his struggles at Springfield this year, they may have a point — although I’d still like to see him given a chance to learn and move up.
Yeah, I’ve got no problem losing David Carpenter in this trade, as the likelihood of him becoming a big leaguer, especially with St. Louis, is slim. I do have a real problem with the roster moves that we’ve seen this year. Mo has made some moves, but he’s made only 1 impact move this season, and in the process, he lost us our 3rd best bat. Signing guys like Winn, Miles, Sup (a good stop-gap but not an impact arm), MacDougal, and now Feliz fills gaps, but does not make a true impact. If you want to fill gaps, use the farm (which does have the pieces, except for SP) instead of going after these re-treads. Mo has only worked to tread water this year, and not improve the team IMO. The longer this season goes on, the more depressing and disappointing it becomes. With moves like these, what do you think Pujols is thinking about the front office and its ability to get the pieces needed to win?
I’m just impressed that they managed to find somebody hitting worse than Brendan Ryan, and I find it almost comical that this is the best the Cardinals could come up with.
They better be much more prepared next year in providing depth at 3rd and SS next year. With the issues they’ve had offensively, providing practically no depth at 3rd or SS this year has proved to be a mistake. Mozeliak has work to do in that regard next year and hopefully will do better in acquiring a more consistent bench.
Probably my most negative post of the year.
Even though I liked Carpenter when i saw him pitch for QC, I agree there are many relief pitchers ahead of him in the food chain, so it is probably no big loss. I think the trade for Feliz has more to do with the defense he will bring than the offense. I would have liked to see them give Gotay a chance instead of this trade. Joe Strauss tweeted that the org. was not impressed with Gotay’s arm in spring training.
At this time of year, the Cards have to take what they can get, for a reasonable price. To get somebody better than Feliz, they would have to surrender a better prospect. Its too bad they did not get Feliz earlier, but better late than never.
“To get somebody better than Feliz, they would have to surrender a better prospect.”
Well, why not do that then? I’m no great fan of Inge or Encarnacion for various reasons, but at least both players offer a genuine upgrade to our current roster and let us dump Aaron F’ing Miles. This seems almost worse than doing nothing to me as they’ve got to put yet ANOTHER garbagey 25th-man-type on the roster who probably can’t play every day and who will suck at a sub-replacement level in nearly all situations (I can just about see him as still worth an AB or two vs LHP if his defense hasn’t fallen off too badly).
We have a bit of a crush of relief prospects and losing a Salas, a Samuel or even a Reifer likely won’t hurt us too badly long-term. Equally, there are a number of badly blocked guys (Chambers, Hamilton, Henley) who might be worth something to a team who has space in the OF or at 1B, and we’ve got quite a few low-minors guys who profile as mid/back-of-the-rotation arms in a few years who it probably wouldn’t hurt the system to lose (Hooker, Kelly, Schneider etc). If we REALLY need to add a third baseman, why not either take on the full salary of someone like Encarnacion in a pure dump (i.e. give up Carpenter but pay the guy’s entire salary the rest of the way) or trade something of actual vague value to pick up one of the remaining vaguely productive guys (Inge and Encarnacion would be OK, I would’ve taken Wigginton too) and have the other team eat some salary.
There’s a lot of ways to acquire an upgrade at 3B, in a year in which we’re contending but suck in the infield, with no apparent help on the farm. We just need to give up some money OR talent. A move where we give up neither money nor talent and add a pretty terrible player seems to achieve nothing, other than adding more mediocrity to a roster that’s drowning in it.
Yes. Agree….and I don’t have to type the three paragraphs.
I disagree that there are a lot of ways to upgrade at 3B. Who? And what did those teams want? The timing of Freese’s reinjury hurt us badly in trying to make a move.
As I understand Encarnacion, he plays terrible defense and is only a moderate upgrade offensively. He provides more power, but I am not sure he is consistent enough to be worth the bad defense. And didn’t I hear clubhouse issues with him?
Has Inge cleared waivers? Is he healthy? He would have been one I would have been interested in.
Feliz was not brought in for the offense. He is a major upgrade defensively. Plus, Lopez was over-exposed at 3B. Maybe some days off and moving back to 2B, a little SS, and a little 3B can light him up again. It is not like Lopez was hitting very well and so we are not losing anything offensively with this move. Essentially we added better defense at 3B and hopefully added some depth(with Lopez moving back to the utility position).
And maybe we will get lucky and Feliz can hit .250.
The problem with this team has been terrible underperformance by almost everyone on the roster. Add in an injury to Freese and we have problems. This is why many opposed moving Ludwick without getting another legit bat in return or in another deal.