Nothing is better this time of the year than a little shaky cam footage of prospects live on site in Jupiter. Nothing against Derrick Goold or the P-D staff, because I love seeing these videos, but both this fielding video and this batting practice video both give me a quick headache. PS P-D team- here’s a iPhone steadycam that costs less than $200. Also, I did not chose the photo above to criticize Cox’s fielding ability.
All of those caveats out of the way, let’s think a little bit about Zach Cox’s fielding and his place in the infield.
Looking at Cox’s fielding prowess here and from scouting reports before and after the draft, third base looks like much more of a natural fit for him. He’s a solidly built dude, the kind of player you rarely see at 2nd base aside from Dan Uggla. He has a solid quick twitch, but his extended range does not look to be capable of filling the middle of the infield. However, the scouting reports echo that observation, as BA said:
Not all scouts are sold on his defensive ability. He does have a strong arm—he threw in the low 90s as a reliever a year ago—and will put in the work to improve his reactions at third base. He also has seen time at second base, and one scout said his actions looked better there, but his athleticism is more suited for the hot corner. (emphasis mine)
Putting the video and scouting reports together seems to indicate that he should stay at 3rd base and the Cardinals focusing early technique work with him there points to the organization putting him at 3rd base going forward. So, despite the depth issues at 2nd, Zack Cox so far looks to be a better fit at the hot corner.
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I agree that he is probably a tick better suited to play 3B, but I still think he can/should be working out at 2B. He spent the majority of his time at Arkansas playing 3B and his improvement over his two years there was definitely noticeable. If given the opportunity to do the same at 2B, with a lot better coaching, I think we will see similar results. He will never be a gold-glover but he would be plenty good enough to at least be a serviceable 2B with some time to get seasoned at the position.
Also, I don’t think he would be any worse there than Skip is and his bat definitely projects to be quite a bit better than Skip. I might be in the majority here, and I know you don’t draft based on need, but Cox has the ability to be a good 2B defensively and above average at the plate for that position. We obviously have somewhat of a weakness there on our current team and in the farm system, IMO he should get some chances at the position so we can at least determine if he would be an upgrade in the near future..
I agree 100%, if we allow skip to play there for 3 plus years I can’t imagine him being any worse there than Skip. Having that solid of a bat at 2B is going to be worth giving up a little D especially when we have Freezy Pop and Carpenter for 3rd. Having 3 cheep guys for one position means we need to trade one of them or move one to another position, I vote Carp and Cox as the 3B and 2B guys for 2012 or 2013? Any takers on that?
I’ve been a fan of both Carpenter and Freese for a while, but I honestly don’t see Freese there long-term with his ankle issues. I’d love to see Carpenter succeed, but until it happens, it’s good to have some depth at a position that’s harder to fill than 2B. And while Cox will be on a fast track, he won’t be ready to take over the position full-time for at least 2 more seasons, even if everything goes right.
I’d love to see Cox make it as a good 2b but I don’t think that not being any worse than Skip should be the criterion for that. I don’t think it would hurt to play him there to start this year and see if he shows the potential to play it well. If not then I think he could pretty quicky readapt to 3b.
I will continue to say I think there is very little to no chance he is a MLB 2B. IMO he is much better suited for 3B. The way he moves and his body type lean heavily to a 3B. If he proves me wrong then great…his bat profiles better at 2B…but I seriously doubt that will happen.
Since the guy’s on the 40 man roster and was given a legit bonus, he needs to play at the position that gives him the best chance to make it to the show as soon as possible. We need his bat
While I’d love it if he were a natural 3b, it’s too soon to say that we have a glut at third. If freese looks healthy and carpenter performs competently, we’ll have to figure that problem out, but I am leery of counting the unhatched chicken that is cox-as-secondbaseman-of-the- future until we have a major league glut of talent there.
I may be in the minority, but I would vote to start him off in his professional career at the position he is most comfortable (3B) and let his bat dictate if/when a positional move needs to be made. There are examples of corner infielders who hit for nice average with minimal power (Boggs), but there are also examples of 2B who transitioned from 3B who weren’t exactly known as athletes (Kent and Sandberg stand out). If he hits enough to man a position that is traditionally a power source, then so be it. If not, a switch to the middle infield might be necessitated. He’s never been described as “brutal” at either spot, and I’m confident Oquendo can help him with a switch down the road.
If all three guys are healthy and hit — Freese, Carpenter, Cox — one of them could end up 1b if Albert leaves. Right field is also an open position going forward. If we can’t find a true power hitter for one of those positions, a high-average guy may be the best we can do.
Now, if we can’t find a 30-HR guy for ANY of the corners … at least we’ll have good memories of the 2000s.
Of course, Allen Craig also could take 1B if Albert leaves. His arm won’t be a problem there, he’s played the position a decent amount in Memphis, and he should be a 30-HR guy if he makes the transition to the majors. Just seems natural to me.
Sorry…”should be a 30-HR guy” really should be “could be.” That’s what I get for posting this late (or is it early?)
On the Mastersball site, which is mostly geared towards fantasy baseball, there are lists of the top 109 long term NL prospects and 109 AL prospects.
They have Zack Cox ranked 29th which is higher than I have seen him elsewhere. Interested in what you guys think of that ranking.
Shelby Miller is 16th, Francisco Samuel is 70th and Tyrell Jenkins is 71st . These lists are behind the subscription, but I printed them and have them in my hands.
Has there ever been a Cardinals prospect who gained more esteem from draft day to his first full pro season, without actually doing anything in between to merit that rise, than Tyrell Jenkins?
Around draft time there seemed to be a realistic view of his potential — nobody knew what his ceiling was, but everyone saw the floor. Now lots of people seem to think he has top-of-the-rotation stuff.
I hope he’s as good as the people making prospect lists assume he is. I just can’t figure out why his potential seems so much higher now than it did when people could actually see him play.
Before the draft, BA had Jenkins ranked #43, and the Cards took him with the 50th pick. BA had Seth Blair ranked #34, and the Cards took him 46th overall. In between, Jenkins pitched 3 innings at Johnson City. He gave up 2 hits, struck out 2, and walked 2. Blair didn’t pitch. Now BA has Jenkins ranked as our #4 prospect, while Blair is #8.
Can anyone explain why Blair’s stock dropped and Jenkins’ rose so dramatically, when neither guy did anything to change his status?
Interesting question. I’m higher on Jenkins because of body type and projection, he seems to have alot of room to grow and improve while Blair is probably close to the pitcher than he always will be. Maybe BA looks into the draftees more once they are choosen and than informs there choices for the BA Team Top 15
It’s just the narrative of the “athlete” with “upside” and people’s biases. Nothing is different today than when these guys were drafted.
That, plus the fact that part of the “risk” with Jenkins was that he wouldn’t play baseball at all. That has now disappeared as an issue.
I guess but I don’t know that there was much risk. Jenkins was not Kyle Parker or Zach Lee. He was like a 2 star recruit at Baylor. And that risk may have explained some drop in draft position (maybe) or a little higher signing bonus (more likely) bu IMO it doesn’t explain much of the relative differences between Jenkins and Blair in how they’ve been treated on prospect lists since the draft.
Can you sell players short – If so, I’m all in on shorting Samuel.