Comments on: The Quietly Good Start For Carlos Martinez

By: Vision

Vision — Fri, 25 May 2012 12:55:36 +0000

No one is arguing that if he needs to be a reliever not to make him a reliever, I was responding to the post talking about his quietly good start and now he doesn’t have as much buzz.

There are reasons he doesn’t have quite the same buzz, and it’s not because of numbers. It’s because of scouting reports questioning if he can remain a starter, and with shoulder concerns now (the worst concerns for a pitcher), you can see why those reports are out there.

By: hugecardsfan

hugecardsfan — Fri, 25 May 2012 05:21:38 +0000

Well, I hope he will be appropriately utilized to obtain maximum value. If he can give us consistent play in the ML’s as a reliever, but will give us sporadic shoulder issues interspersed with brilliant starts, I’d settle for the pen.

The big team lost again tonight with poor pen work after an incredible offensive return. The pen needs to be solid from soup to nuts. I don’t really care what his prospect ranking is….in the final analysis, I want the player to contribute at the ML level and do so consistently.

I think Cincy will give us fits this year, not because their starters are better than us, but because their pen is….way better.

By: Vision

Vision — Thu, 24 May 2012 16:45:49 +0000

I think it’s important to note that Carlos main questions have never been results or stuff, but more in the way he achieves the results. He’s a smallish righty with a big fastball and developing secondary stuff at High-A. to eveolve into a SP at the big league level he needs to be more efficient and develop the secondary offerings to where he can’t just overpower hitters.

CMart has a bright future, but due to the effort in his delivery (which has improved) and the secondary offerings lagging a bit behind, many still see his future as a reliever. Being a reliever in the end severely hampers his overall value, so I hope he can remain a starter.

By: BigRob

BigRob — Thu, 24 May 2012 16:14:28 +0000

We’re not on the same page.

I’ve had TJ. I know what it’s like. Part of Wainwright’s early struggles are due to facing MLB hitters (Swagerty won’t). Part of it is because his stuff isn’t completely back yet (takes nearly 2 years). Part of it is because he doesn’t have the control back yet (takes nearly 2 years).

I have a feeling the Cards will put him in the bullpen next year to limit his innings coming of TJ (like Matt Morris). Who knows, maybe they’ll put him in extended Spring Training and put him at a short-season club so he can be a starter and build innings.

As the Cardinals have proven over past years, just because you’re in the bullpen doesn’t mean you will never be a starter again (Looper, Wainwright, Piniero, McClellan, Lynn, Rzepchinski, etc. etc.).

This is really simple. You think he’ll go back to being a starter (I guess) and I think he’ll remain in the bullpen with an eye towards a Sept. callup if he’s needed (because I don’t have a lot of faith in our bullpen moving forward).

By: Andrew

Andrew — Thu, 24 May 2012 15:03:24 +0000

He will have just came off TJ, Remember how Wainwright has struggled with consistency once coming back. The organization may want him to stick at starter as he is coming back. No need to rush him really especially such a young guy that may. It’s rushing or not depending on what the organization wants to do with him starter or reliever. Also it’s quite the assumption that he will come off surgery and immediately have those stats.

By: BigRob

BigRob — Thu, 24 May 2012 14:52:41 +0000

The one question I keep coming back to is “Is it really rushing him if he’s ready?”

This came up when someone made a comment about rushing Kolten Wong and/or Oscar Taveras. I used the example of Wil Myers (he was still at AA at the time). Is it really rushing the guy if he’s hitting .340 with a high OBP? To me that means he’s ready for another challenge.

For example, if Swagerty is 3-0 with 1.00 ERA and 12 K/9 and 3 K/BB after two months in AA next season, is it rushing him to AAA? I, for one, do not think so. Just a difference of opinion, I suppose.

By: Andrew

Andrew — Thu, 24 May 2012 14:09:17 +0000

They aren’t going to rush someone who just had TJ surgery.

By: BigRob

BigRob — Thu, 24 May 2012 14:01:28 +0000

Wasn’t he in relief in Springfield last year? I was thinking he may start there if he looks alright in Spring Training.

So he if he starts in AA next season, he could see a promotion to AAA by June. Once he gets to AAA, he’s probably only an injury or unseccessful performance away from being called up. All of this depends on his stuff coming back to normal, however.

By: Andrew

Andrew — Thu, 24 May 2012 05:37:27 +0000

I don’t think he will get his stuff together and be able to skip 2 levels and be in STL by end of next year. Maybe the year after if they want him as a reliever.

By: BigRob

BigRob — Thu, 24 May 2012 04:59:39 +0000

He will most likely end up in a relief role, especially next year as he attempts to recover from surgery. It’s a shame because, in my opinion, #3 starters are more valuable than set-up men or closers.

He was probably always destined to be a high leverage reliever anyway. We could potentially see him in STL late next season. Possibly as a September call-up.