Comments on: The Untouchables

By: Hugecardsfan

Hugecardsfan — Tue, 24 Jul 2012 17:18:16 +0000

You can’t really separate the two trades. Without Furcal we don’t make the WS either. Both trades absolutely necessary to the final success of the team.

By: Richard

Richard — Mon, 23 Jul 2012 23:50:28 +0000

1. Baseball Reference has Felix’s WAR at 2.7 this year so far and 3.4 last year. Other than 2009 & 2010, he’s actually been 4 WAR or less every year, according to BR.

2.
“And he’ll be moving to a league where he’ll be throwing at opposition pitchers, instead of DHs.”

Should not matter with a relative measure like WAR. WAR is not ERA. There’s no reason to expect a replacement-level pitcher in the AL to be better than a replacement-level pitcher in the NL or vice versa.

3.
“And SAFECO doesn’t suppress power that much more than Busch”

What do you consider “power”? Compared to Busch, in 2012, Safeco substantially depresses homers. And doubles. And triples: http://espn.go.com/mlb/stats/parkfactor

The Mariners score the least runs at home of any AL team. They score the _most_ runs away from home of any AL team.

4.
“Felix is legitimately one of the 4 or 5 best pitchers in baseball.”

In 2012, Felix is currently 17th in bWAR. In 2011, Felix was 28th in bWAR. In 2010, Felix was 3rd in bWAR. In 2009, Felix was 13th in bWAR.

Outside of 2010, Felix has never been one of the 5 best pitchers in baseball, according to BR.

Even by fWAR, Felix has never been in the top 4 any year besides this year (so far), though granted, he was close in 2009 & 2010.

By: Felonius_Monk

Felonius_Monk — Mon, 23 Jul 2012 11:28:25 +0000

We traded Alex Castellanos for Furcal. Hawksworth was traded to LAD prior to the start of the season for our oh-so-excellent pre-Furcal shortstop, Ryan “no-glove” Theriot.

By: Felonius_Monk

Felonius_Monk — Mon, 23 Jul 2012 11:24:38 +0000

You keep throwing this “4 WAR” thing out there, Richard. Hernandez has put up an average of greater than 6 WAR/yr for the past three seasons, and is ALREADY at 4 WAR this year, after only 20 starts. And he’ll be moving to a league where he’ll be throwing at opposition pitchers, instead of DHs. And SAFECO doesn’t suppress power that much more than Busch (certainly not enough to overcome the DH adjustment).

I get it that you don’t rate him and you don’t think there’s much surplus value in $20m, that’s fine. I just don’t think the “4 WAR” thing is close to factually accurate. Felix is legitimately one of the 4 or 5 best pitchers in baseball.

By: Felonius_Monk

Felonius_Monk — Mon, 23 Jul 2012 11:15:29 +0000

So you’re saying that our Wong is touchable?

By: Evan

Evan — Sun, 22 Jul 2012 20:05:15 +0000

Okay but what about rzep and Dotel? Both were HUGE pickups for our bullpen last year. Our bullpen was in major disarray before they came. Plus in the playoffs tlr used the bullpen so much, there is no way we win it all with Trevor miller as out loogy. Furcal was very important but the Rasmus trade was more crucial IMO

By: giveml

giveml — Sun, 22 Jul 2012 12:40:40 +0000

11-13 from Rasmus trade until Furcal trade. 23-12 afterward. Jackson was pretty good, but all the pitchers improved after Furcal took over at short. Can’t overstate how abysmal Theriot was at short – below replacement level.

By: mike

mike — Sun, 22 Jul 2012 09:56:09 +0000

we dont make the playoffs without edwin jackson

By: Richard

Richard — Sun, 22 Jul 2012 03:11:59 +0000

Regression to the mean.

By: Indiana Cardinal

Indiana Cardinal — Sun, 22 Jul 2012 02:51:53 +0000

As I suggested above the White Sox gave up two low level prospects for Meyers and got Youkalis a few weeks ago for virtually nothing. In both cases the Red Sox and Astros gave the White Sox alot of money to help pay the contracts for Youkalis and Meyers.

Mozeliak said today he intended to be active, suggesting relievers instead of starters. We’ll see which direction they ultimately try to go, but I don’t think they should have to give up much unless they get someone with a contract beyond this season.